The Swirlies just released "Cat's of the Wild Vol 2," an EP that fans have no doubt been waiting years for. Damon Tutunjian and Andy Bernick of the Swirlies gave us an interesting and often bizarre look at what's been going on with the sometimes dreamy, sometimes goofy indie band from Boston and their carefree side project, the Yes Girls.

Yes Girls David Brackeen (DB): What's the difference between the Yes Girls and the Swirlies? Damon Tutunjian: What it basically boils down to is we're pretty confused about what the heck the Yes Girls are. It's just us having fun and being… Andy Bernick: … a little more carefree than we are in the Swirlies. Damon: Yeah, if that's possible. Taang vs. Bubble Core DB: I heard you guys had some issues with your former record label, Taang. Is that true? Are you glad to be off Taang?

Damon: We had a really hard time on the label. We signed a very bad contract. They certainly helped us a lot in the beginning. I think Curtis changed - sort of his label went more from being something that proactively put forth new bands to something that was more of a catalog label. And that didn't really work for us.

DB: And the new release "Cats of the Wild Vol 2" is on Bubble Core.

Damon: That's our drummer's label, Adam Pierce. Because no one else would sign us [laughs]

DB: So that's probably a better a situation then?

Andy: Definitely. But also they do a very good job with their releases like Dylan Group and Mice Parade. I think it's definitely much better than it would have been on Taang.

Damon: Yeah. Adam is probably one of the few people who is genuinely psyched to put out a Swirlies record, which is great.

Swirlies present
DB: What's the current line-up of the band?

Damon: It's sort of different every time. For the next tour with the Lily's in May and June I guess it's going to be myself, Adam on drums, Rob on guitar, this girl Doro is going to sing, and Mike Walker from the Lily's is going to fill in for Andy on the bass. 'Cause

Andy, you're doing something then.

Andy: Yeah, I'm in a doctoral program right now. I do some bird research and it's my field season, so summertime is bad for touring, at least right now.

Damon: Whereas the South by Southwest show was Andy, myself, Adam, Rob, and Deb Warfield who sings on the record.

Shows in strange places
DB: So I know you guys have played some strange places like tents. And I actually saw you guys play ten years ago in a suburban backyard in the middle of the afternoon in Texas.

Andy: Alright!

Damon: You were there?

DB: Yeah!

Damon: At what's-his-name's… Jesus, no wait, Christ. Johnny Christ was his name.

DB: [laughs]. That was very generous of you. You guys played a free show for the people who couldn't see you guys play at the club the night before.

Andy: Right, it was because the place was 21 and over. And I guess most of the fans there at the time who came to see the show were probably under 18.

Damon: Now they're 30.

DB: [laughs]
Andy: So that fellow made a suggestion, and we decided to take him up on it. That's actually my most favorite show memory, ever. That was a blast. It was very nice to do.

DB: Yeah I was 18 at the time, and I couldn't go to the show the night before because I had to work. So it was great that I could see you guys the next day. But the funny thing is, I was actually supposed to work that day at 4pm - I was a cashier at Six Flags - but the show lasted too long, so I just didn't go to work, didn't call in or anything. I went to work the next day, and of course I'm there for five minutes when the manager calls me to his office. He turns to me and says, "Dave… I'm sorry, but you can't wear those blue shoes here anymore. You're going to have to wear either white or black shoes."

Andy: [laughs]

Damon: [laughs] That's awesome.

DB: He didn't even know that I had missed a day of work. He was completely oblivious. So that was a highlight. So what other strange places have you played? Do you play free shows like that often?

Damon: Definitely the first couple of tours, we'd play the show, then play in a basement for free.

Andy: When we were starting out we'd play a lot of parties in Boston. Every once in a while we get to do something like that. We did a Yes Girls show…

Damon: For the Film Archives.

Andy: Yeah, the Anthology Film Archives in New York.

Damon: That was actually my favorite Yes Girls show ever. That was good. We played in an alley between two buildings.

DB: How was the South by Southwest show?

Damon: It was kind of a mess.

Andy: Yeah.

Damon: We're not accustomed to the saturnalia of downtown Austin [laughs]… on a Friday night or whatever it was.

Shoegazing
DB: Do you guys consider yourself a shoegazing band?

Damon: No! [laughs]

DB: When you are called a shoegazing band, how do you feel?

Damon: It's fine. As long as they acknowledge us for something, it's okay [laughs].

Andy: I guess we were placed in that category when we were playing in the early nineties. Compared to the other stuff on Taang, I guess we were more shoegazing than punk rock.

Damon: We're a little too goofy to be called shoegazing, I think.

DB: Do you think you've moved away from the shoegazing sound over time?

Damon: There's tons of elements of it, but there's always been that, plus crazy goofiness. I think that's why a lot of those shoegazing people don't like us. I think people who only want the real serious stuff get turned off by Swirlies. Shoegazing is like, you're supposed to have this aura, you know? And I think we're not serious enough for that. Not that we're not serious about the music, but there's sort of a bit of a whacky element in what we do.

DB: Well we're doing a section on shoegazing, so I'm gonna ask you questions about shoegazing anyway. What is it like to be an American shoegazing band in 2003?

Andy: It's great!

Damon: Gosh, it's amazing. The sneaker styles are so much better now than they used to be. People come out, and they're chanting, "shoegaze". Everyone's wearing black and standing next to the speakers so they can get it full volume. And have moppy hair. And wearing stripy shirts.

DB: And every once in a while, someone will write a note and put it by your shoes so you can see it?

Andy: Yeah.

Damon: Did that used to happen?

DB: I dunno, I just made it up.

Damon: [laughs] What would the note say?

DB: "You guys rock"

Damon: [laughs] A shoegazer would write "you guys rock"? I don't think so!

DB: I dunno, just ignore me from now on. What do you think of all the new American bands that are doing shoegazing sounds?

Andy: I'm actually not familiar with those bands.

Damon: I can honestly say I'm not familiar with more than five new bands. No diss to shoegazing, but I just don't listen to it.

What the Swirlies are listening to DB: So speaking of albums, what's the last record each of you has bought? Damon: Bought or burned? Andy: [laughs] DB: Either one. [laughs] Listened to? Stolen? Damon: I haven't bought anything. I've burned plenty of stuff. Andy: I bought a Rocket from the Tombs CD when I was in South by Southwest. Damon: Oh yeah, how was that? Andy: It was pretty good. I enjoyed that. But that's not shoegazing music.

Damon: I just burned Hardcore Devo, you know that record? It's really good.

Andy: It's like mid-70's demo things, right Damon? Like very bizarre.

Damon: Yeah it's good. Volume two though, not volume one. And I burned some stuff I have on record, like Fear of Music. Oh and I got that Lali Puna, you know that? Some German band, Lali Puna. I don't know if I like it. It's kind of funny. It's kind of a German girl talking over computer music, sort of. It's ok, I think. And I heard another one… Miss something? Andy, remember that?

Andy: Ms John Soda?

Damon: Yeah, Ms John Soda. Yeah, I liked that.

DB: And Justin Timberlake, right?

Andy: Yes, of course.

Damon: I haven't heard that. Is he a shoegazer?

DB: You know, I think he does more of a dance routine, but I'm not really sure.

Damon: But he's really good and he doesn't have to look at his shoes.

War with Iraq
DB: So, off topic, what do you guys think of the war with Iraq?

Damon: Ugh.

Andy: Uh, boy. It's a hard thing to have a simple outlook on. I'm for and against various aspects of it, and it's quite a gray situation to me. My wife's uncle is over there, and her brother's in the navy, so this is the first thing where I've had someone I personally know involved in it. It adds a personal element to war that I haven't seen before, so I have conflicting emotions about it.

Damon: I'm completely against it. I went through a big stage of confusion. And I don't necessarily agree with all the protesters. I think a lot of people jump on the protesting bandwagon. But I've been reading a lot, and I'm tired of being manipulated by our so-called government. I certainly enjoy reading about the Bilderberg's, and all that stuff like the Bilderberg conference and the Trilateral Commission. I think there's agendas behind it and I think Bush is a very poor manipulator who is manipulating and doing a really crappy job at it. They should have got a better puppet than him. That's how I feel. Not that I think that the French and German stance is altruistic. I don't think they're in the best interest in the world.

Andy: Our drummer, Adam, was arrested at the New York City protest. It seemed like it was quite a harrowing experience for him. He's obviously against it. This was the one that was back a few months ago.

Damon: When I was living in Spain, there were huge anti-American, anti-globalization protests like a year ago. Just tens of thousands of people. People were coming from all over Europe to do these things. It was really bandwagonesque, you know? And I'm sure there were people who really knew their stuff and understood exactly what they were arguing against. But I have a hard time with a lot of the protesting, too. Although I certainly sympathize with it to some extent. It’s not that I'm against it. And I am far from being informed. It's like people saying there's a god, there's no god. This situation is so convoluted and confusing at this point because we've been deliberately confused. And I feel like there's lots of rash decisions being made on both sides. But like I said, I sympathize with the protesters, and I'm glad people are doing it, but I wonder how much people know what exactly they are protesting. That's all.

Lyrics, Ostriches, and Sneaky Flutes
DB: So back on topic, Damon, what inspires your lyrics?

Damon: My general misery. [laughs]

DB: I know you guys have probably been asked this question a million times, but what's with all the ostriches?

Damon: Uh, no comment.

DB: [laughs]

Damon: It's kinda like the Yes Girls: there is no explanation.

Andy: This might tie in with why we don't fit in with shoegazing.

Damon: Yeah, ostriches. Definitely a turn off.

Andy: Well, not ostriches, but we tend to get fixated on things, like a little name, or having something there. It started out with a photograph on the back of our first Taang compilation with an ostrich on it. It was a photograph that my uncle took when he was at Great Adventure, the wild animal park.

Damon: [laughs] Where's Great Adventure?

Andy: It's in New Jersey.

Damon: [laughs]

Andy: You know, it's one of those places where there are wild animals that walk around, and you drive your car down a road, and so a gorilla will come up to your car. Maybe not a gorilla, but an ostrich will be sitting in the road. So he took this photo. And he gave me the photo, and we put it on the back of the record, and it became just something we've fixated on and it's almost like a little good luck charm to have on everything. It's just something we need to do now. That's an attitude we have about a lot of things, names, goofy names like Sneaky Flute Empire. Something that comes up randomly but then we fixate on it and have to use it all the time.

Damon: We're very sentimental.

Andy: Yes.

Damon: We're our biggest fans. We have nothing else to cling to.

DB: [laughs] Hey, that's great. I'm all about narcissistic bands.

Andy: In loo of huge audiences coming to see us, we cling to little things.

DB: Yeah that's my other question, about the Sneaky Flute Empire. What does that encompass?

Damon: The world.

DB: [laughs]

Damon: The sun never sets on the Sneaky Flute Empire.

Andy: It's just, I guess it's uh, well, you know…

Damon: Sneaky Flute! Why are you even trying to explain it?

DB: [laughs]

Andy: [laughs] I don't know, it's good to think about these things.

DB: Okay, it's unexplainable.

Damon: I am not Sneaky Flute.
[pause]

DB: You are not Sneaky Flute?

Damon: I am not Sneaky Flute.

Andy: It's sort of a collective idea that we are trying to work out, something where we can collect all of our recordings and things that we do. Sort of like a label / collective that doesn't quite work.

Damon: We always wanted to be a collective band, and now we are.

Andy: And we're doing it more now, because we switch lineups all the time, and we invite many people to do things with us. But in the past where people left and didn't come back, now people leave and come back at will.

Damon: "At will" [laughs] Except me, I'm not allowed to.

Andy: Right, not you, 'cause you're the heart.

Damon: If I didn't sing, though, hell, I could come and go.

Andy: True.

Swirlies past and future
DB: Damon, are you the only Swirlies member that has always been there?

Damon: No, Andy has too.

Andy: Well there were times when I wasn't as active in it. But as far as the songwriting and recordings and stuff I've pretty much been a part of that.

Damon: And Seana's on the album, too. She's an original member.

Andy: And she's been doing her own thing, but she's kinda come back to the fold a bit and works with us now and then.

Damon: Actually on the Japanese release Ben Drucker's on it too. So there ya go, four original members.

DB: So are we gonna see more Swirlies stuff coming out on a more regular basis?

Andy: Yup.

Damon: Yup. Keep in mind, we've been putting stuff out. We put out an album on Taang in 98, and then we put out all these cassingles, which came out as the Yes Girls in 2000. Andy's put out two compilations which you can order through our web site, "Nevah Have I Evah" and "30 Minutes on the World Map" which have Swirlies songs on them, and other bands. Lots of other bands. We're just kinda low profile, not necessarily on purpose.

Andy: Well, I think somewhat on purpose.

Damon: The world has cast us off.

Andy: Strike that!

Damon: [laughs] No, we're perfectly happy. We have plenty of new songs in the works. Just deciding who, what, when to put them out on.

Andy: I think the thing with Taang was very discouraging. And then I moved out of Boston to New York, and things happened to slow down around that time. But we're starting to get our ducks in a row. But we're starting to put things out and play a lot more. Damon: And we're hoping for a continual degradation of sound quality. Andy: [laughs] Yeah. Damon: As opposed to the normal trend where you get super-slick, Swirlies get even shittier. DB: Alright, that's gonna be the title of the article: "Swirlies Get Shittier"

Andy: [laughs] Something that someone wrote about our live show that we did once in Boston, they said, "Leading the hit parade down a dead-end street into a wall." I've always enjoyed that line.

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